From matthew@debian.org Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:36:11 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:36:11 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) ARGH!!! Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw Matthew ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:27:11 +0100=20 From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999=20 Hi Matthew, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and this is my first day back in the office. Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for yo= u at the show if they are making a profit out of you? Regards Jonathan > -----Original Message----- > From:=09Matthew Vernon [SMTP:matthew@debian.org] > Sent:=0925 August 1999 11:49 > To:=09Jonathan Heastie > Subject:=09RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999=20 >=20 > On Mon, 23 Aug 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: >=20 > > I'm sorry but I am not going to be able to give you a free stand at the > > show.. > >=20 > > Despite the fact that I am sympathetic to your cause, the problems > derived > > from giving one exhibitor free space are too many to mention. I have > over > > 45 companies that are investing over =A3100,000 with me and I cannot > possibly > > run the risk of antagonising them by taking money from them but not fro= m > > you. Redhat and SUSE, for example, have spent considerable marketing > funds > > on the show and I am sure that they would not look kindly upon me givin= g > one > > of their rivals a promotional space at the event for absolutely nothing > when > > they had used up months of budget on just one event. > >=20 > > Do you appreciate my problem? Can you suggest an alternative? Is ther= e > > absolutely no money? >=20 >=20 > Dear Jonathan, >=20 > I think you have misunderstood the nature of Debian a little. >=20 > Debian is a voluntary not-for-profit organisation - we > are in no way commercial competition for people like RH and Suse. We make > no profits whatsoever from sale of CDs (although vendors such as Linux > Central can sell them at a profit if they wish - they keep all of that > though): we survive entirely on donations of time, hardware and money. It > is usual for major exhibitions to donate booths to Debian - LinuxExpo > (http://www.linuxexpo.org), Linux World Expo > (http://www.linuxworldexpo.com), and Linuxtag (http://www.linuxtag.org) > all have, for example; surely if donating a booth to Debian was offensive > to companies, then these expos would be unable to do so? Nevertheless, if > you feel RedHat and Suse might be angered by such a donation, then perhap= s > you could contact them, to see if they would object to Debian being > donated a booth? >=20 > Furthermore, your website states: >=20 > We invite you to register for your free VIP visitor pack for > the UK's forum for the new Enterprise computing revolution - > Linux Expo '99. Every major participant in open source > software will be present to provide a definitive review of all > the latest products and services emerging around Linux >=20 > The Debian Project is one of the biggest open source projects in the Worl= d > - our social contract (available from www.debian.org) which states that > Debian will always be 100% free software makes us unique amongst Linux > distributions, and Debian is amongst the top two or three distributions i= n > terms of user base. As such, to exclude us from your Expo would be to los= e > a "major participant in open source software", and being a voluntary > organisation, we cannot produce the sums of money needed to finance booth= s > at Expos; in the past major Expos have donated booths to Debian, and I > hope that you will feel able to continue this trend. >=20 > Yours sincerely, >=20 > Matthew > --=20 > Matthew Vernon > Debian developer > http://www.debian.org >=20 >=20 From damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 1 Sep 1999 16:54:21 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 16:54:21 +0100 (BST) From: David Damerell damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Matthew Vernon wrote: >ARGH!!! >Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw In extremis; get nasty. (Threaten to?) Slashdot them as claiming to have all the major distributors when they do not? -- David/Kirsty Damerell. damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~damerell/ w.sp.lic.#pi.2106 |___| "Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc." Confessed Mercrediphile. |___| | | | Or, in Klingon: "nucharghqangbogh chaH DISopchu' 'e' wItIv." | | | From phil@hands.com 01 Sep 1999 17:40:54 +0100 Date: 01 Sep 1999 17:40:54 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Matthew Vernon writes: > ARGH!!! > > Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw What if we get people from current exhibitors to get in touch with them and tell them that they don't object to us getting a freebie, and that in fact they object to us not getting a freebie. Anyone got the contacts to swing that one ? Alternatively, we could adopt guerrilla tactics, and just turn up and set up a Debian stand on a few tables near the bar. This would have the added advantage of guaranteeing that our stand would be near the bar, but might result in them throwing us out. More ambitious, hack into their system, and add ourselves to the list of exhibitors ;-) Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 03 Sep 1999 14:46:18 +0100 Date: 03 Sep 1999 14:46:18 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Jules Bean writes: > > What if we get people from current exhibitors to get in touch > > with them and tell them that they don't object to us getting a > > freebie, and that in fact they object to us not getting a freebie. > > > > Anyone got the contacts to swing that one ? > > I don't have any contacts, but that sounds like a sensible strategy. > Perhaps contact a few potentially sympathetic organisation (Linux > Central, maybe even RedHat..) and ask them for opinions.. Perhaps someone like Alan Cox or Steven Tweedie would see our point of view, and might be in a position to get the RedHat marketing folks to do what we want. I've met them both, but I doubt they know who I am. Can anyone do better than that? Cheers, Phil. From matthew@debian.org Wed, 8 Sep 1999 13:53:21 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 13:53:21 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: > Hi Matthew, > > Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and this > is my first day back in the office. > > Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for you > at the show if they are making a profit out of you? Not really - their market is almost entirely US-based. They have contributed a lot to Debian already - to ask them to pay for a booth at a smallish Expo outside of the US would be ridiculous. Besides - I thought you were aiming to have all the major players? Without Debian, that claim will not wash with those that know the Free Software community. I notice you have not responded to my other suggestions either; can I not persuade you that donating a booth to Debian would be in the interests of improving the quality of the Expo? Regards, Matthew From matthew@debian.org Wed, 8 Sep 1999 16:59:00 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 16:59:00 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Some progress.... ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 15:21:27 +0100 From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 The problem I have is that space is minimal and I have a target to hit. If I give space away, thus losing revenue, I will not hit my target (even small stands make a difference!). I think that I might get to my target in the next week or so and, if I do, I will then have the option to drop prices or (and I've never done this before!) give you a free stand (this is also subject to stand availability too as there are only 5 spaces left and they may have to be sold to get to the target). Do you see my problem? Regards Jonathan > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthew Vernon [SMTP:matthew@debian.org] > Sent: 08 September 1999 13:53 > To: Jonathan Heastie > Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 > > On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: > > > Hi Matthew, > > > > Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and > this > > is my first day back in the office. > > > > Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for > you > > at the show if they are making a profit out of you? > > Not really - their market is almost entirely US-based. They have > contributed a lot to Debian already - to ask them to pay for a booth at a > smallish Expo outside of the US would be ridiculous. > > Besides - I thought you were aiming to have all the major players? Without > Debian, that claim will not wash with those that know the Free Software > community. I notice you have not responded to my other suggestions either; > can I not persuade you that donating a booth to Debian would be in the > interests of improving the quality of the Expo? > > Regards, > > Matthew From russell@coker.com.au Thu, 9 Sep 1999 13:22:59 +0200 Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 13:22:59 +0200 From: Russell Coker russell@coker.com.au Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: PGP keys --Boundary-=_oQHnWnkUEwHsqmGbbuqCLJJiVswM Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Sun, 22 Aug 1999, you wrote: >I've tried to find your PGP and/or GPG keys in the Debian keyrings and on >several of the keyservers but I couldn't find them. If you can give me a >place to get them I'll be happy to sign them... I've attached my public key to this email. What is the proceedure for getting my key into the public key servers? The debian-keyring package documents it for pgp but not for gpg. Once you sign my key what do we do next? -- I'm in Utrecht. I'd like to meet any Linux users in the area, or any other part of the Netherlands. --Boundary-=_oQHnWnkUEwHsqmGbbuqCLJJiVswM Content-Type: text/plain; name="public" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="public" LS0tLS1CRUdJTiBQR1AgUFVCTElDIEtFWSBCTE9DSy0tLS0tClZlcnNpb246IEdudVBHIHYxLjAu MCAoR05VL0xpbnV4KQpDb21tZW50OiBGb3IgaW5mbyBzZWUgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5nbnVwZy5vcmcK Cm1RR2lCRFlna1NjUkJBQ3BFVXd6UE5XcEFkNnhlMTdBR2FZMngzOGdmbTF4TDY0YTUxcEhtd0M1 MHcwYmIycmoKSStNN1dTdmlkYnhham9kWlN1a2tEMmNMekVOWVRxZ3pMMll3Snk4d0g2MmVoTGts SlZVYzlhaFZ1WHRUcTdzZgpVeFlmZmxnZUJBMDhmQy9FeElMcURKM2U3Z3NkeGMraStKbFNPNmE4 bGY0R1czTFdrK2x2TjQ2cSt3Q2c0ZVQxCjBHUmFDSlptU3lSMDJOOWdMS2dQd1ZzRC9qTkNUbS9U S2xoUjd5M0pkdGp4OVBNbkhiMU1sNHFhUmJ5Zm1rTnMKSVJVdGx6R1J5R1hIQWkxSllrT1NuTXI2 QlFDSk5sOHljZDkyQkJsZ2U4ZTNnZm9DenZzZGRpTkdrNml6Q0Z4VwpVbnpnbkwwLzFrZ3FlMzRU SFNPdUpYckRIYXBWMnBaUUMwbGZoTk1nQkNmKzh3Y3ArMXMrcElRdlNLWE01SHVzCnJ1MTBCQUNF T0xpS1dwNDltVi8zQjlvZ3NqZklJTWlLR2lmRFRoQmg1NXEySUNoV1BZblJsaXZPb3M5VWd6K3EK ckpyV3VtY0JJQzBiZ29PWDBTWE5JL0ZvNkQ4N08xY0xpd3MxM29YUFR4YldnMU92UjlabEFPc05w SFBXSEExQgp4NC8wMzFsMmdWWDJnYTBvbFdKTzFKbGtHTnBOelVKaTUzODdhODdoNkV1UjE5SExv YlFrVW5WemMyVnNiQ0JECmIydGxjaUE4Y25WemMyVnNiRUJqYjJ0bGNpNWpiMjB1WVhVK2lGY0VF eEVDQUJjRkFqWWdrU2NEQ3dRREJSVUQKQWdZQkF4WUNBUUlYZ0FBS0NSRENzSG44OWNkU1ZrNXZB SjBXT1gzVW5SeHQyWEdrQThqcGtyMTUxdUEzWlFDZgpkTy9EbDg1SzdSQ1J3RkR5Z2tuTW8rNVN2 WUs1QVEwRU5pQ1JOaEFFQUtOTEFjbk9XMmhmejBCNlZiQkJOa2xICmloeW5qTUwvWjMxRDZ1RFJk S1c4MlJKUDZmM1pMMjQ3ZlliYVlscXBHN2pxT0FDcDY4c0lIZDluSUFIL0prKzMKUTE0OXVyV1dW OTJUTDBMZG5YK3pZTHYzOTFoTHZtWkNRVW55VFhUSFc3MmdGRGFLc1FYZUFXYnpyQmdaL0xaeQpa R0JHWDhteEY5Y0gyUVhFVEJPVEFBTUZBLzk0elVGNVVMcS9nc1pnNG1tMkJ2aVBWSXR0dTY4bStV TjFJQlduCkpKYVdoeVFtS3dQWG96eENZMGh3cVlyK0pjT1FSSm83bWNoYktWTlN6NnBWRERlUGlo NDJJTUVTU2Y2ck10d3QKYmRZNGJJVHFUYjgrcHVxSWtvb3VRb1grWHRLZ3BjeDlrMEhUWVdFSlhz TjNvMUNyc3pnY2RtVktsNFMvaDBoTwpJK1hTUG9oR0JCZ1JBZ0FHQlFJMklKRTJBQW9KRU1Ld2Vm ejF4MUpXVTh3QW4xYXJUaUQwYzVSSDVGaUZZV3k4CkR0YmtyTU9zQUtDMnhpR3psSTA4VlNTVE5j a0pZbmxzVmxVTWhBPT0KPSsvQXAKLS0tLS1FTkQgUEdQIFBVQkxJQyBLRVkgQkxPQ0stLS0tLQo= --Boundary-=_oQHnWnkUEwHsqmGbbuqCLJJiVswM-- From phil@hands.com 09 Sep 1999 13:53:49 +0100 Date: 09 Sep 1999 13:53:49 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: PGP keys Russell Coker writes: > [1 ] > On Sun, 22 Aug 1999, you wrote: > >I've tried to find your PGP and/or GPG keys in the Debian keyrings and on > >several of the keyservers but I couldn't find them. If you can give me a > >place to get them I'll be happy to sign them... > > I've attached my public key to this email. What is the proceedure for getting > my key into the public key servers? The debian-keyring package documents it > for pgp but not for gpg. put a line like this in .gnupg/options: keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net and then run: gpg --send-keys [names] with the names being whatever makes: gpg --list-keys [names] list the keys you want to send. BTW wwwkeys.pgp.net maps to one of several real machines, some of which are dead, so if an upload doesn't work, just try it again. Cheers, Phil. From russell@coker.com.au Thu, 9 Sep 1999 23:35:33 +0200 Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 23:35:33 +0200 From: Russell Coker russell@coker.com.au Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: PGP keys >> I've attached my public key to this email. What is the proceedure for getting >> my key into the public key servers? The debian-keyring package documents it >> for pgp but not for gpg. > >put a line like this in .gnupg/options: > > keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net > >and then run: > > gpg --send-keys [names] I've done that. Has it worked? -- I'm in Utrecht. I'd like to meet any Linux users in the area, or any other part of the Netherlands. From phil@hands.com 10 Sep 1999 08:10:40 +0100 Date: 10 Sep 1999 08:10:40 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: PGP keys Russell Coker writes: > >> I've attached my public key to this email. What is the proceedure for getting > >> my key into the public key servers? The debian-keyring package documents it > >> for pgp but not for gpg. > > > >put a line like this in .gnupg/options: > > > > keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net > > > >and then run: > > > > gpg --send-keys [names] > > I've done that. Has it worked? if you go to http://wwwkeys.pgp.net and search for russell@coker.com.au you get to somewhere like: http://pgp5.ai.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=index&search=russell%40coker.com.au&fingerprint=on which reads: Public Key Server -- Index ``russell@coker.com.au '' Type bits/keyID Date User ID pub 1024/F5C75256 1998/10/11 Russell Coker Key fingerprint = D5 1E 60 CA 98 99 60 09 F1 A4 B4 CD C2 B0 79 FC F5 C7 52 56 Is that yours ? Cheers, Phil. From tfb@tfeb.org Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:24:36 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:24:36 +0100 (BST) From: Tim Bradshaw tfb@tfeb.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: Linux "workstation" vendors in UK? * Jose Marin wrote: > On a related note, this colleague of mine probably got carried away by > those BT ads about BT-Highway, and she wants an ISDN at home too. > Does it really pay off? And how often do you really get 128 Kbps? I > venture to say that unless you generate *lots* of Mb of traffic, a > regular V.90 modem (~40 Kbps) will be more than enough, but I'd like > to hear other people's opinions. Although I have a boring modem connection at the moment, I would say based on previous experience that an ISDN line is definitely worth it if you are at all serious. I don't know about what bandwidth they actually get, but I'd agree with the other followup that if you're just surfing the web it prpbably isn't worth it. But if you fetch any reasonable amount of stuff, or do something like remote CVS, then ISDN is a win. It's mostly a win because the latency is so much better than phone lines, so everything feels a bunch more `real-network' like. It's also a win if you want to do dial-on-demand PPP because the connect time is a few seconds rather than 30 or so. In a former life, I started off doing this over a modem and it didn't really work because DNS timed out while the thing connected. When we got ISDN it was just like having a real connection. Having an ISP who would dial *us* on demand was a big win too, of course. Related to this: does anyone know what the real story is about proper leased-line-type prices -- I keep hearing rumours they are about to plummet and as we're likely to need a permanent connection quite soon I'm hesitant to pay the current extortionate rates. Alternatively are there any ISPs who will do dial-on-demand ISDN networking who will dial *out* on demand as well (obviously charging for the phone calls). These sort of people used to exist. --tim From phil@hands.com 17 Sep 1999 20:22:29 +0100 Date: 17 Sep 1999 20:22:29 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: Linux "workstation" vendors in UK? Tim Bradshaw writes: > * Jose Marin wrote: > > > > On a related note, this colleague of mine probably got carried away by > > those BT ads about BT-Highway, and she wants an ISDN at home too. > > Does it really pay off? And how often do you really get 128 Kbps? I > > venture to say that unless you generate *lots* of Mb of traffic, a > > regular V.90 modem (~40 Kbps) will be more than enough, but I'd like > > to hear other people's opinions. BT Highway is an attempt by BT to palm the public off with their abandoned ISDN variant, rather than the new ISDN2e standard. This is why it has been dubbed ``Highway Robbery'' by many. This is also why BT are studiously avoiding calling it ISDN. You need to have a very good idea of how much you are going to use ISDN before you buy it, then find out as much as you can about the pricing structure BT are offering this week (they seem to switch it round regularly, to try and maintain the level of confusion they've created). The thing to remember is that the cheapest headline deals almost always cost you more than the expensive ones. > Related to this: does anyone know what the real story is about proper > leased-line-type prices -- I keep hearing rumours they are about to > plummet and as we're likely to need a permanent connection quite soon > I'm hesitant to pay the current extortionate rates. This is what I've heard: Cable Modems --- fast, cheap, not available, don't work too well ADSL --- fast, cheap, although getting more expensive by the minute, not available (both of the above are having problems getting ISPs that are willing to be on the other end of them too.) BT cheap leased lines --- there was a rumor that BT were going to offer a cheap leased line connection, but reading between the lines it looks like they were going to give you 64K to your local exchange, then let you share a damp piece of string to the world with everyone else in a five mile radius, with no guarantees of availability or bandwidth. > Alternatively are > here any ISPs who will do dial-on-demand ISDN networking who will > dial *out* on demand as well (obviously charging for the phone > calls). These sort of people used to exist. This has the same disadvantage as Tele2's pay per byte deal, which is that if someone doesn't like you, they can run your phone bills up for you. Cheers, Phil. From P.Allen@pallen.dabsol.co.uk Fri, 17 Sep 1999 22:43:42 +0100 Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 22:43:42 +0100 From: Peter Allen P.Allen@pallen.dabsol.co.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: Linux "workstation" vendors in UK? Tim Bradshaw wrote: > > * Jose Marin wrote: > > > On a related note, this colleague of mine probably got carried away by > > those BT ads about BT-Highway, and she wants an ISDN at home too. > > Does it really pay off? And how often do you really get 128 Kbps? I > > venture to say that unless you generate *lots* of Mb of traffic, a > > regular V.90 modem (~40 Kbps) will be more than enough, but I'd like > > to hear other people's opinions. > > Although I have a boring modem connection at the moment, I would say > based on previous experience that an ISDN line is definitely worth it > if you are at all serious. I don't know about what bandwidth they > actually get, but I'd agree with the other followup that if you're > just surfing the web it prpbably isn't worth it. But if you fetch any > reasonable amount of stuff, or do something like remote CVS, then ISDN > is a win. It's mostly a win because the latency is so much better > than phone lines, so everything feels a bunch more `real-network' > like. It's also a win if you want to do dial-on-demand PPP because the > connect time is a few seconds rather than 30 or so. In a former life, > I started off doing this over a modem and it didn't really work > because DNS timed out while the thing connected. When we got ISDN it > was just like having a real connection. Having an ISP who would dial > *us* on demand was a big win too, of course. > > Related to this: does anyone know what the real story is about proper > leased-line-type prices -- I keep hearing rumours they are about to > plummet and as we're likely to need a permanent connection quite soon If you've got ntl in your area then a cable modem is well worth it. 512Kb down 128Kb up guarenteed, no phone bill, £40 a month. The only thing it doesn't do is statically assigned ip addresses, although that _can_ be fixed. In my rather limited experiences of them (through a friend) they work rather nicely. Peter Allen From rasilon@tardis.ed.ac.uk Fri, 17 Sep 1999 20:34:34 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 20:34:34 +0100 (BST) From: Derry Hamilton rasilon@tardis.ed.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: Linux "workstation" vendors in UK? On Fri, 17 Sep 1999, Tim Bradshaw wrote: > Related to this: does anyone know what the real story is about proper > leased-line-type prices -- I keep hearing rumours they are about to > plummet and as we're likely to need a permanent connection quite soon > I'm hesitant to pay the current extortionate rates. Alternatively are > there any ISPs who will do dial-on-demand ISDN networking who will > dial *out* on demand as well (obviously charging for the phone > calls). These sort of people used to exist. Having just put a leased line in, BT's NetStart package was the cheapest at 3 grand a year for a 64k leased line, a router your end and a wad of IP addresses. The improvement over an ISDN dialup response wise is about the same as ISDN v POTS. Derry Hamilton rasilon@tardis.ed.ac.uk /******************************************************************** * I think your cats need tuning - according to a couple of quick * * measurements on a recently calibrated reference cat, the dominant * * frequency of a correctly adjusted cat should be 12Hz +/-20%. * * ===Lionel Lauer on a.s.r=== * *********************************************************************/ From matthew@debian.org Tue, 21 Sep 1999 12:21:28 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 12:21:28 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Success! nearly (wasRE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999) >>>>> "ItEvents" == Jonathan Heastie writes: ItEvents> Hi Matthew, I may be able to help you out now. One of ItEvents> my exhibitors has decided to cancel their stand because ItEvents> they've already overspent their budget and can't afford ItEvents> to fly over from Germany and stay (as well as pay me for ItEvents> the floorspace). ItEvents> The stupid thing is that they are liable to pay me 100% ItEvents> of the stand cost anyway even if they don't come. This ItEvents> also means that I could offer you their stand at the ItEvents> show but they would actually be paying for it! ItEvents> I'm still waiting for them to confirm their withdrawal ItEvents> in writing (I can't do anything until then) but, if they ItEvents> do do what they've said they're going to do, are you ItEvents> intersted in jumping in? I shall of course reply shortly accepting the offer :) /me wonders who has just pulled out... Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From edward@debian.org Tue, 21 Sep 1999 15:27:39 +0100 Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 15:27:39 +0100 From: Edward Betts edward@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Success! nearly (wasRE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999) Matthew Vernon wrote: > ItEvents> Hi Matthew, I may be able to help you out now. One of > ItEvents> my exhibitors has decided to cancel their stand because > ItEvents> they've already overspent their budget and can't afford > ItEvents> to fly over from Germany and stay (as well as pay me for > ItEvents> the floorspace). > > ItEvents> The stupid thing is that they are liable to pay me 100% > ItEvents> of the stand cost anyway even if they don't come. This > ItEvents> also means that I could offer you their stand at the > ItEvents> show but they would actually be paying for it! > > ItEvents> I'm still waiting for them to confirm their withdrawal > ItEvents> in writing (I can't do anything until then) but, if they > ItEvents> do do what they've said they're going to do, are you > ItEvents> intersted in jumping in? > > I shall of course reply shortly accepting the offer :) > > /me wonders who has just pulled out... Germany? Sounds like Suse to me. -- I consume, therefore I am From matthew@debian.org Tue, 21 Sep 1999 16:16:54 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 16:16:54 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Hi all, Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have about 2 weeks to organise things. People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? T-Shirts: Phil? Yrs, Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From phil@hands.com 21 Sep 1999 18:14:22 +0100 Date: 21 Sep 1999 18:14:22 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Success! nearly (wasRE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999) Edward Betts writes: > > I shall of course reply shortly accepting the offer :) Ace :-) > > > > /me wonders who has just pulled out... > > Germany? Sounds like Suse to me. I wonder how they'll feel about paying for our stand ;-) Perhaps we could cheer them up by having a ``Sponsored by SuSE'' banner on the stand. Hm, maybe not. BTW I've mailed a few T-Shirt people an been greeted with a resounding silence. I'll ring round tomorrow, but if anyone else knows of a place we can get T-Shirts printed, at reasonable rates, drop me a line. Cheers, Phil. From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Tue, 21 Sep 1999 19:07:14 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 19:07:14 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Oops. Chiark bounced it. (Braindead netscape puts in an invalid sender: header. I don't seem to be able to stop it. Bugger. Oh well, back to .cam soon, and then exim will be doing my rewriting anyway) On Tue, 21 Sep 1999, Jules Bean wrote: > Matthew Vernon wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > > about 2 weeks to organise things. > > > > People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on > > this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? > > Modulo any unavoidable university commitments, I can be there both > days. Probably driving to/from Cambridge in my car. > > > Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) > > Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? > > It doesn't look like Linux will be running on my powermac by the 6th, so > that's out. I can bring an intel box, but we have many. I can bring a > sun3, but it doesn't have a monitor, and IIRC, it's not supported by > Linux 68k. I can bring a mac LCIII, which is, AFAIK. I can maybe bring > a sparc, but it weighs a ton, so it will be rather inconvenient :-) > > > T-Shirts: Phil? > > Don't forget CDs. Time to mobilise Steve and/or Phil :-) (God knows > what state potato's in, especially for non-i386, though). > > > "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." > > "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." > > hehe! > > Jules > > -- > /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ > | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | > | Jules aka | | Richmond, Surrey | > | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | > +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ > | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | > | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | > \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ > /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From james@nocrew.org 21 Sep 1999 22:17:54 +0100 Date: 21 Sep 1999 22:17:54 +0100 From: James Troup james@nocrew.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Success! nearly (wasRE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999) Edward Betts writes: > > /me wonders who has just pulled out... > > Germany? Sounds like Suse to me. I doubt it... according to various (reliable) people @ Kongress they have so much money, they don't know what to do with it. And I can't seem them throwing away such a good chance to make inroads into the UK... -- James From edward@debian.org Tue, 21 Sep 1999 23:44:09 +0100 Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 23:44:09 +0100 From: Edward Betts edward@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Matthew Vernon wrote: > Hi all, > > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > about 2 weeks to organise things. > > People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on I go to University tommorow, I might be off the net a while, I will try and attend. > this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? > Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) > Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? > T-Shirts: Phil? -- I consume, therefore I am From J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Wed, 22 Sep 1999 00:06:41 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 00:06:41 +0100 (BST) From: Julian Gilbey J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 > Hi all, > > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > about 2 weeks to organise things. > > People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on > this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? > Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) > Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? > T-Shirts: Phil? I intend to be there. I can bring a laptop running (almost) pure slink. I'll buy a Debian T-shirt for the occasion if someone has them available. I'll certainly help with the stall, but having never done this before, I'd really appreciate some guidance. It is probably worth us having a list of comparisons with the other major distributions so that the inevitable "Why do you think your distribution is better than [Red Hat/SuSE/whatever]?" can be answered effectively, focusing on the major points rather than minutiae. I will post on -private to ask about this. Julian =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Julian Gilbey, Dept of Maths, QMW, Univ. of London. J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Debian GNU/Linux Developer, see http://www.debian.org/~jdg From phil@hands.com 22 Sep 1999 02:57:03 +0100 Date: 22 Sep 1999 02:57:03 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Matthew Vernon writes: > Hi all, > > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > about 2 weeks to organise things. > > People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on > this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? I should be around for both days, although it seems I may also be on another stand for some of the time, promoting a new trade association type thing for linux consultants in the UK (if we've actually got anything to show by then ;-) > Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) > Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? I have: A Sparc IPX with something like a 19" screen (heavy cube thing on a swivel stand). I've not done much with this, so it's not really set up properly, but if someone wants to play with it, it might be worth bringing. A fare amount of Intel kit, some of which I could bring along. Probably enough network kit to provide 10base2 & 10baseT networking, and 10/100 hub if required. Also cables, and things like transceivers for drop-cable to 10base2 connections. A total lack of useful transport (I ride a motorcycle, and don't have a car) I may be able to cadge an Ezio monitor or two, and some more miscellaneous hardware off of some friends, so if people have kit that is almost worth bringing, except for the lack of a whatever, mention it and we'll see what we can put together. > T-Shirts: Phil? I'll put some real effort into doing something about this tomorrow (anyone who knows of decent places to get Tshirts done, please mail me). We could do with a tag line, too, for back printing, or under the logo. I quite like in jokes, so the idea of simply putting ``debian/rules'' on the back appealed to me. Any better ideas. Cheers, Phil. From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 22 Sep 1999 08:46:38 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 08:46:38 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 On Wed, 22 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >> People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on >> this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? I can do both days, driving down from Cambridge with a car full of kit. >> Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) >> Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? > >I have: > > A Sparc IPX with something like a 19" screen (heavy cube thing on a > swivel stand). I've not done much with this, so it's not really set > up properly, but if someone wants to play with it, it might be worth > bringing. > > A fare amount of Intel kit, some of which I could bring along. > > Probably enough network kit to provide 10base2 & 10baseT networking, > and 10/100 hub if required. Also cables, and things like > transceivers for drop-cable to 10base2 connections. > > A total lack of useful transport (I ride a motorcycle, and don't > have a car) I have a pair of intel machines, one with a nice 19" monitor. I can also provide lots of 10baseT network kit, including an 8-port 10/100 switch and an 8-port 10 hub. >I may be able to cadge an Ezio monitor or two, and some more >miscellaneous hardware off of some friends, so if people have kit that >is almost worth bringing, except for the lack of a whatever, mention >it and we'll see what we can put together. Agreed. >> T-Shirts: Phil? > >I'll put some real effort into doing something about this tomorrow >(anyone who knows of decent places to get Tshirts done, please mail >me). > >We could do with a tag line, too, for back printing, or under the logo. >I quite like in jokes, so the idea of simply putting ``debian/rules'' >on the back appealed to me. Any better ideas. *grin* -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Wed, 22 Sep 1999 11:34:25 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 11:34:25 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 On 22 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > I have: > > A Sparc IPX with something like a 19" screen (heavy cube thing on a > swivel stand). I've not done much with this, so it's not really set > up properly, but if someone wants to play with it, it might be worth > bringing. > > A fare amount of Intel kit, some of which I could bring along. > > Probably enough network kit to provide 10base2 & 10baseT networking, > and 10/100 hub if required. Also cables, and things like > transceivers for drop-cable to 10base2 connections. > > A total lack of useful transport (I ride a motorcycle, and don't > have a car) > Where's the kit located? I expect Steve or I can come by and provide transport. Jules /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From phil@hands.com 22 Sep 1999 11:44:11 +0100 Date: 22 Sep 1999 11:44:11 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Jules Bean writes: > Where's the kit located? I expect Steve or I can come by and provide > transport. Near Reading, but it looks like Steve's got doubles for everything I've mentioned, so perhaps it's not worth the effort. Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 22 Sep 1999 11:51:50 +0100 Date: 22 Sep 1999 11:51:50 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Hi, I've just been reminded that on the 5th of Oct I'm going to a Whiskey Tasting at Imperial College. This is good in that I can be around Olympia until about 6pm on the Tuesday if people are needed to set things up. It's bad in that I doubt I'll be much use to anyone on Wednesday morning (if past events are anything to go by, I'll be vaguely sober by about midday) I'll probably be fairly cheerful, in an unfocused way though. :-) Cheers, Phil. From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 22 Sep 1999 11:01:24 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 11:01:24 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 On Wed, 22 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >Jules Bean writes: > >> Where's the kit located? I expect Steve or I can come by and provide >> transport. > >Near Reading, but it looks like Steve's got doubles for everything >I've mentioned, so perhaps it's not worth the effort. Maybe... Matthew has just informed me that we have a 4 square metre booth, so we'll have to be picky about what we use. Suggestions? -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From phil@hands.com 22 Sep 1999 12:21:45 +0100 Date: 22 Sep 1999 12:21:45 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Steve McIntyre writes: > Maybe... Matthew has just informed me that we have a 4 square metre booth, > so we'll have to be picky about what we use. Suggestions? That's 2m x 2m, right ? Hm. A large stack of CDs, some chairs, a coffee machine and a libretto ? ;-) We could probably do with a machine with a nice big monitor, but multiple platforms are not going to actually impress you're average PHB (that is the target audience isn't it), so you could probably give the same impression by having headless boxes (possibly not even plugged in ;-) Enough of an network so we can do NFS installs onto laptops might be good --- apparently Debian stands often turn into laptop install-fests at expos. I have a D-Link DE620 (thinnet parallel port thing) that makes installation on really crap laptops possible, and a 10 and a 10/100 PCMCIA ethernet card. A table to stand all the laptops that turn up would be good. I've asked a couple of companies that I deal with if they could lend us some stand materials (I'll get back to you when they reply). Does anyone else have similar contacts, in case mine don't come through, or have we already sorted this out ? Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 22 Sep 1999 21:16:59 +0100 Date: 22 Sep 1999 21:16:59 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts I've found a few prices on the Internet, and phoned a couple of places, and have a quote the seems as good as any so far. This is using screen printing, which should give a much nicer quality print than the transfer, iron-on, style printing AFAIK. They are doing what they describe as ``Very good'' quality T-shirts on a special offer, on the following basis: one-time cost per screen 15 quid (2 colours front, 1 back = 3 screens) printing price, per shirt 25+ 50+ 100+ 2.50 1.80 1.10 And the white T-Shirts are 3.15 each, or you can really splash out on some that are 4.60 Another alternative that apparently might work with the logo are the same shirts in light grey, at 4.20 and 5.15 respectively. If we back print a tag line that's an extra screen (i.e. 15 quid for the whole batch), and it will take two screens for the two colours on the front. So if we go for 25 white (3.15) shirts, with back printing it costs: (3 * 15.00 + 25 * (2.50 + 3.15)) * 1.175 = 218.84 (8.75 each) for 50: (3 * 15.00 + 50 * (1.80 + 3.15)) * 1.175 = 343.69 (6.87 each) for 100: (3 * 15.00 + 100 * (1.10 + 3.15)) * 1.175 = 524.64 (5.25 each) So, what sort of demand are we looking at here ? Also, are people worried about the quality ? Obviously, there are economies of scale here, but I'm not desperately interested in finding that I have three hundred quids worth of T-Shirts in the corner of my room, that nobody wants. Also, given that once these guys have made the screens, they will not charge for them to be reused, we want to make sure that we get the design right first time, so what's it going to be ? Are we just going to do the open-license logo (http://www.uk.debian.org/logos/openlogo-100.jpg) blown up to a bit bigger than A4, or can anyone think of something more inventive ? Also, what about the back print ? I'm not certain that I'm willing to pay 15.00 to put ``debian/rules'' on the backs, so either give me ideas, or tell me that it is worth most of a pound a T-shirt, or tell me to forget it. BTW We need to hurry on this, they normally need a two week lead time, but are willing to make allowances. I also need to have some idea of which sizes we should get made. BTW I'll probably fork out the extra 1.50 on the really pricey shirts for myself, so tell me if money is no object. I may go for one of the light grey ones too, which sound good. Alternatively, we could look at getting some of them printed on promotional quality shirts, which should knock a couple of quid off, so if people are tempted to get some to give away, that could save you quite a lot. Talk to me. Cheers, Phil. From matthew@debian.org Thu, 23 Sep 1999 12:25:27 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 12:25:27 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts I'd personally prefer better quality t-shirts, but that's just me. On the back, how about: debian/changelog debian/dirs <=Add the rest of debian/ here debian/control debian/rules <=in bold Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From phil@hands.com 23 Sep 1999 15:09:49 +0100 Date: 23 Sep 1999 15:09:49 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts Matthew Vernon writes: > debian/changelog > debian/dirs <=Add the rest of debian/ here > debian/control > debian/rules <=in bold Hm, the whole thing would end up being too long IMO, so we're going to have to be selective, in which case it would be good to make it appear to make some sort of sense, even though it doesn't: debian/watch debian/examples debian/files debian/control debian/rules Maybe? Although I think that goes away slightly from something that I quite like about the simple one liner, which is that to a lay person this T-Shirt will not even hint that it is a computer related thing, so one can walk among ``normals'' without advertising oneself as a nerd. Maybe you like advertising yourself as a nerd, but I find that it leads to either the assumption that you're a boring git, or worse, conversations about how to get things to appear in bold in MS word . BTW good news folks, John Winters of the The Linux Emporium has agreed to underwrite the Tshirts, by taking up to 100 off my hands if I get stuck with them, so I can go for a big print run: This gives us the following prices (per shirt, including VAT): Good White: 5.52 V Good White: 7.22 Good Birch: 6.75 V Good Birch: 7.87 I should be getting a sample of each (A good white, and a V.Good Birch) in the post tomorrow, so I'll tell you if I think they're worth the extra, but from the description I'll probably go for one of each colour, top quality. Given that the screens can be reused, the next run will be cheaper, but it does mean that we need to make sure that the design is ``right'' first time, or we'll have to pay for new screens next time round. Cheers, Phil. From russell@coker.com.au Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:18:30 +0200 Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:18:30 +0200 From: Russell Coker russell@coker.com.au Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts >Although I think that goes away slightly from something that I quite >like about the simple one liner, which is that to a lay person this >T-Shirt will not even hint that it is a computer related thing, so one >can walk among ``normals'' without advertising oneself as a nerd. > >Maybe you like advertising yourself as a nerd, but I find that it >leads to either the assumption that you're a boring git, or worse, >conversations about how to get things to appear in bold in MS word >. My laptop has Linux stickers all over it. I find that when I get it out in bars, restaurants, public transport etc it often leads to opportunities to teach people about the benefits of Linux. When I went to Berlin for a weekend a few weeks ago the man who sat next to me on the way to Hannover became interested in Linux. I gave him a SUSE demo CD (it was all I had). Last time I went to Australia I taught two people about the benefits of Linux (people sitting on both sides of me on the way to Singapore). No such luck on the way back. On the way to Bizarre99 the girl sitting next to me on the train started asking me about my computer (the program you're writing looks so complicated ;). She seemed less interested after I revealed that I only plan to stay in the country a few weeks... :( I don't have problems with people thinking I'm a nerd. When someone asks me about MS Word problems I just tell them that I don't use it because it's expensive, buggy, and generally not much good. -- I'm in Utrecht. I'd like to meet any Linux users in the area, or any other part of the Netherlands. From matthew@debian.org Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:30:16 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:30:16 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts Philip Hands writes: > I should be getting a sample of each (A good white, and a V.Good > Birch) in the post tomorrow, so I'll tell you if I think they're worth > the extra, but from the description I'll probably go for one of each > colour, top quality. > What colour is birch? grey, I presume... Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From olly@lfix.co.uk Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:31:35 +0100 Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:31:35 +0100 From: Oliver Elphick olly@lfix.co.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Matthew Vernon wrote: >Hi all, > >Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have >about 2 weeks to organise things. > >People: How many of you can make it, and do you know anyone not on >this list who would be prepared to come and man the stall? >Software: recommendations? (Debroster, the source-code scroller...) >Hardware: who has what they'd be willing to bring? >T-Shirts: Phil? I can attend both days and the set-up the previous afternoon, since I'm working in London on Tuesday morning. I have a laptop with unstable on it. I won't be available at all next week, because I'm going to Greece for a week's holiday (Sunday to Sunday). Please let me know if you need me for both days or only one (both is OK). -- Vote against SPAM: http://www.politik-digital.de/spam/ ======================================== Oliver Elphick Oliver.Elphick@lfix.co.uk Isle of Wight http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1 ======================================== "Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth; That thine alms may be in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly." Matthew 6:2-4 -- Vote against SPAM: http://www.politik-digital.de/spam/ ======================================== Oliver Elphick Oliver.Elphick@lfix.co.uk Isle of Wight http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1 ======================================== "Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth; That thine alms may be in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly." Matthew 6:2-4 -- Vote against SPAM: http://www.politik-digital.de/spam/ ======================================== Oliver Elphick Oliver.Elphick@lfix.co.uk Isle of Wight http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1 ======================================== "Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth; That thine alms may be in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly." Matthew 6:2-4 From A.J.Gray@durham.ac.uk Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:42:46 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:42:46 +0100 (BST) From: Andrew Gray A.J.Gray@durham.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts sorry, there's no way I can take the time off work to help at the expo, but I'll get my 2 shillings in on the T-shirts debate... Andrew ps good luck at Olympia and well done! On Thu, 23 Sep 1999, Russell Coker wrote: > >Although I think that goes away slightly from something that I quite > >like about the simple one liner, which is that to a lay person this > >T-Shirt will not even hint that it is a computer related thing, so one > >can walk among ``normals'' without advertising oneself as a nerd. > > My laptop has Linux stickers all over it. I find that when I get it out in > bars, restaurants, public transport etc it often leads to opportunities to > teach people about the benefits of Linux. agree with Phil on this one. the 'debian/rules' thing is so simple - and if you want to talk Linux, it gives you all sorts of opportunities to discourse on debian's packaging system, unix makefiles etc etc. (perhaps 'debian/control' would be better for that, but one line is better than two, and 'rules' sounds more fun and less fascist.) From matthew@debian.org Thu, 23 Sep 1999 19:41:13 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 19:41:13 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Oliver Elphick writes: > I won't be available at all next week, because I'm going to Greece for a > week's holiday (Sunday to Sunday). Please let me know if you need me for > both days or only one (both is OK). ATM, both may well be better, if you can spare the time Thanks, Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From phil@hands.com 23 Sep 1999 21:19:32 +0100 Date: 23 Sep 1999 21:19:32 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts Matthew Vernon writes: > Philip Hands writes: > > > I should be getting a sample of each (A good white, and a V.Good > > Birch) in the post tomorrow, so I'll tell you if I think they're worth > > the extra, but from the description I'll probably go for one of each > > colour, top quality. > > > > What colour is birch? grey, I presume... That's what I'm told (light grey), I'll tell you when I see the sample tomorrow. Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 23 Sep 1999 21:42:24 +0100 Date: 23 Sep 1999 21:42:24 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian T-Shirts Andrew Gray writes: > agree with Phil on this one. the 'debian/rules' thing is so > simple - and if you want to talk Linux, it gives you all sorts of > opportunities to discourse on debian's packaging system, unix > makefiles etc etc. (perhaps 'debian/control' would be better for > that, but one line is better than two, and 'rules' sounds more > fun and less fascist.) I've decided to go with that, mostly because of time pressure, and because John (who's offered to buy all the spares) likes it. I've printed it at 100pt in courier, which ends up being about 24cm across, and looks reasonably good. The only question now is whether to print it in black or red (or something else) ? BTW does anyone here know anything about pantone colours ? The postscript contains a line: %%CMYKCustomColor: 0.15 0.96 0.67 0.01 (PANTONE Rubine Red 2X CVC) does that mean that the name for the colour that I have to tell the printers about is ``Rubine Red 2X CVC'' ? BTW, it looks like someone has cocked up on the postscript that's on the debian web site. I had to go to Raul's page at offshore to find some postscript that didn't have a distorted swirl. Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 26 Sep 1999 23:56:02 +0100 Date: 26 Sep 1999 23:56:02 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Matthew Vernon writes: Hi Matthew, > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > about 2 weeks to organise things. So, what goes on ? I've got a couple of feelers out for stand gear (partition walls etc.), but haven't heard back yet. Do you know how many Exhibitors passes we need and/or are going to get? Now that they've given us a stand (N. 127 according to the web site) perhaps we should encourage as many Debianites to turn up as possible. A short mail to the main lists would probably be appropriate, mentioning that the free online registration is closing on the 30th. Also, mentioning that if you set your job title as ``Debian Developer'' or ``Debian User'' (as appropriate) it will end up on the badge, and might put an interesting twist on their database. T-Shirts: ========= I've sent the T-Shirt designs off, and will be getting 100 printed. The default will be XL reasonably decent white shirts (for 5.52 IIRC) but there is the option of spending a little more on ``Birch'' (very light grey flecks) which looks quite good, and/or slightly heavier T-shirts. The most expensive combo being about 8 quid. If you have special requests for size, quality or colour, get them in quick because I'll have to finalise the details with the printers pretty soon. BTW, I've gone for the ``debian/rules'' back print (simply printed in lower case 100pt (I think) Courier, which comes out being about 25cm wide). The front separation was a total bastard to get sorted out, mostly because I wasn't happy with the quality, so ended up having to render it at 720dpi, and then mess about with a 800MB bitmap for hours (with The Gimp crashing with unfunny regularity), but in the end the swirl looks pretty bloody excellent IMO. I only hope it transfers cleanly onto the screen, and so onto the shirts. Anyone have opinions about whether to print the back in Black or Red (or perhaps something else)? Cheers, Phil. From russell@coker.com.au Sat, 25 Sep 1999 20:33:30 +0200 Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 20:33:30 +0200 From: Russell Coker russell@coker.com.au Subject: [Debian-uk] Penguin candy bars See http://www.coker.com.au/~russell/pics/e-bus-candy.jpg for what this company can do. Now imagine a penguin in the candy bar with the slogan "Linux Rocks"! 466 pounds for 10,000 candy bars is a reasonable price (if you have a need for 10K candy bars). Now if we sold 1000 of the candy bars at 0.50 each it would cover the cost of the rest which could be given away at trade shows etc. What do you think? ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: QUOTATION FOR ROCK CANDY BARS Date: Mon, 30 Nov 1998 15:12:28 -0000 From: Julie Wilcock Dear Russell You spoke with my colleague, Gill Mole, last week requesting a price for rock candy bars. Please find below the costings you require:- 6" Rock Candy bars in 3 colours with a 1 colour label Qty: Upto 10,000 Cost: £466.62 Carriage will be extra at cost I have given you the 10,000 rate for any quantity from 1000 upto 10,000 Hope this is okay Kind Regards Julie Wilcock Customer Services Team Leader ------------------------------------------------------- -- I'm in Utrecht. I'd like to meet any Linux users in the area, or any other part of the Netherlands. From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Mon, 27 Sep 1999 11:08:16 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 11:08:16 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 On 26 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > Do you know how many Exhibitors passes we need and/or are going to get? > > Now that they've given us a stand (N. 127 according to the web site) > perhaps we should encourage as many Debianites to turn up as possible. > A short mail to the main lists would probably be appropriate, > mentioning that the free online registration is closing on the 30th. Doh! I was assuming that I'd be coming in on an exhibitor pass. I guess I can't take that for granted. Should I register, then? Jules /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From chris@fluff.org Mon, 27 Sep 1999 23:08:42 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 23:08:42 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Pinted key-signing Hi -- I'm in Cambridge until Tuesday night, and was wondering if any developers were around to either (a) have a pint, or (b) sign my PGP key..? Short notice, I know.. -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 11:13:35 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 11:13:35 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Equipment for expo OK. I have just got my LCIII back from the person who was borrowing it. If we want it at the expo, I need to take it to cambridge with me at the weekend, so I can use the ethernet in my bedroom to install Debian on it and bring it back down with me next week. So, do we want it? It's small and light, and someone suggested that it might be good to show how debian can leverage legacy hardware. It's a 25Mhz 68030, so it's pretty damn legacy. (I'm not quite sure what the precise status of linux-m68k on this mac is, I'm checking that out now) Jules /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From chris@fluff.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:21:43 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:21:43 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Equipment for expo On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Jules Bean wrote: > If we want it at the expo, I need to take it to cambridge with me at the > weekend, so I can use the ethernet in my bedroom to install Debian on it > and bring it back down with me next week. Oh, this gives me an idea -- would anyone like to see an Acorn StrongARMed RiscPC running Debian? :) I could be persuaded to sling that under my ARM (hur hur) and take it down... -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From phil@hands.com 28 Sep 1999 09:54:40 +0100 Date: 28 Sep 1999 09:54:40 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? Hi, A possibly silly idea for the stand: Get a polypin of Fuller's (the local beer) and give it away (possibly conditional upon buying Tshirts and/or CDs) That way we can say: This is Free Software. That's Free as in Free Speech, not Free Beer! This, on the other hand is Free Beer. See? The only problem is whether we're allowed to serve drinks, or do the bars have some sort of monopoly? Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 27 Sep 1999 12:54:10 +0100 Date: 27 Sep 1999 12:54:10 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Jules Bean writes: > On 26 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > Do you know how many Exhibitors passes we need and/or are going to get? > > > > Now that they've given us a stand (N. 127 according to the web site) > > perhaps we should encourage as many Debianites to turn up as possible. > > A short mail to the main lists would probably be appropriate, > > mentioning that the free online registration is closing on the 30th. > > Doh! > > I was assuming that I'd be coming in on an exhibitor pass. I guess I > can't take that for granted. Should I register, then? Well we need to know how many to ask for at least, and it would be good if everyone registered anyway (I have) so that you can at least get in to pick up your exhibitors badge, or possibly so that we can get everyone in regardless of the number of Exhibitors badges they hand out. It looks like putting ``Debian Developer'' in as your Job title will mean that this appears just under your name. Cheers, Phil. From chris@fluff.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:54:36 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:54:36 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 On 27 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > It looks like putting ``Debian Developer'' in as your Job title will > mean that this appears just under your name. I've actually registered already, under "IT Administrator" for Collegium Records, but an exhibitor's pass would be nice...? -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:31:54 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:31:54 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On 28 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > Hi, > > A possibly silly idea for the stand: > > Get a polypin of Fuller's (the local beer) and give it away (possibly > conditional upon buying Tshirts and/or CDs) And only one each, too, except staff :) > > That way we can say: > > This is Free Software. > That's Free as in Free Speech, not Free Beer! > This, on the other hand is Free Beer. > See? > > The only problem is whether we're allowed to serve drinks, or do the > bars have some sort of monopoly? I think that's a very cool idea indeed. However, we'd want to (politely, diplomatically) ask mr. heastie about this first... If we did it, I wonder if any of us has access to a large printer (A2, I suppose) which we could use to print a banner with the above dialogue on it (plus two arrows pointing to the pile of CDs and the pile of beer). Jules /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:40:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:40:02 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? Philip Hands writes: > Hi, > > A possibly silly idea for the stand: > > Get a polypin of Fuller's (the local beer) and give it away (possibly > conditional upon buying Tshirts and/or CDs) How much would that cost? > The only problem is whether we're allowed to serve drinks, or do the > bars have some sort of monopoly? That sounds like an excellent idea :) Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From chris@fluff.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:52:24 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:52:24 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Jules Bean wrote: > If we did it, I wonder if any of us has access to a large printer (A2, I > suppose) which we could use to print a banner with the above dialogue on > it (plus two arrows pointing to the pile of CDs and the pile of beer). I've got a 1200x1200 dpi A3 printer, and if sticking pieces together ain't good enough, BluePrint (round the corner from the Warner) will do it. It eats PostScript, too. :) -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From phil@hands.com 28 Sep 1999 15:31:46 +0100 Date: 28 Sep 1999 15:31:46 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? Matthew Vernon writes: > Philip Hands writes: > > Hi, > > > > A possibly silly idea for the stand: > > > > Get a polypin of Fuller's (the local beer) and give it away (possibly > > conditional upon buying Tshirts and/or CDs) > > How much would that cost? I'll look into it. I may be able to get a barrel at cost price from one of the bars at Imperial College, in which case we might have a chance of not running out in the first half hour of the show. > > The only problem is whether we're allowed to serve drinks, or do the > > bars have some sort of monopoly? > > That sounds like an excellent idea :) Glad you like it :-) BTW do you know what we're getting as part of the stand ? Does it include a ``shell scheme'' ? (that's the fluffy walls that you can velcro things to) Also, when do we get to go in to set up? Tuesday some time? Cheers, Phil. From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:48:37 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:48:37 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Chris Rutter writes: > On 27 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > > It looks like putting ``Debian Developer'' in as your Job title will > > mean that this appears just under your name. > > I've actually registered already, under "IT Administrator" for > Collegium Records, but an exhibitor's pass would be nice...? I've asked for 8, which will arrive by post. To save me postage, people who have registered will be given their pass in person on the day. Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From steve@greenend.org.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:00:12 +0100 Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:00:12 +0100 From: Stephen Early steve@greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? In article <87ogen5cq5.fsf@sheikh.hands.com> you write: >Matthew Vernon writes: >> Philip Hands writes: >> > Hi, >> > >> > A possibly silly idea for the stand: >> > >> > Get a polypin of Fuller's (the local beer) and give it away (possibly >> > conditional upon buying Tshirts and/or CDs) >> >> How much would that cost? > >I'll look into it. I may be able to get a barrel at cost price from >one of the bars at Imperial College, in which case we might have a >chance of not running out in the first half hour of the show. You won't get a barrel (288 pints) - almost nobody sells them these days. They're too awkward, anyway. You might get a kilderkin (144 pints), but even that's a bit big. A firkin (72 pints) is the best bet (multiple firkins if you're feeling rich) - they can be carried over short distances by one man, and only need two people to lift them up onto a table. If you want to serve real ale you need to consider the following: o the casks must be in place at least 24 hours before the time at which you expect to start serving; ideally more o you need to keep the casks cool - 12C is ideal. You can do this using towels soaked in water laid over the casks, with a desk fan pointing at them; cooling by evaporation. You need to make sure that the towels are dampened every half-hour or so. o you need at least the following: spiles (soft and hard) taps spare keystones chocks a rubber mallet corks (to close the casks once they are empty) slop buckets glasses o it would be nice if you had a venting spile (so you don't spray beer everywhere when you vent the casks) When you are setting up the first thing you should do is put the casks on their side in the position in which they are going to be used. Use three chocks per cask, ensuring that the cask is supported at three points only (for stability - i.e. make sure the cask is only touching the chocks). Make sure that cooling starts as soon as the casks are stillaged. A couple of hours later you should vent the casks that you expect to use the next day. Either use the venting spile, or a hard spile. Once the tut has been punched through, insert a soft spile. The beer will 'work' (release CO2) for potentially several hours, and eventually stop. When it stops, replace the soft spile with a hard spile. When you need to serve the beer, remove the hard spile. The first third of a pint from the cask will likely be cloudy - throw it away. The second third of a pint should be clear; if it isn't you need to leave the cask to settle for a bit more time. When you finish serving beer (the end of the session) put the hard spile back in. When the cask is about half-empty, use the chock at the back to tilt it up until the bottom of the back of the cask is level with the tap; this will let you get the last couple of pints of usable beer out at the end of the cask. When the cask is empty, hammer the hard spile all the way in, remove the tap, and hammer a cork into the tap hole. Make sure that the casks are returned to the brewery - you will have paid a deposit on them, but it doesn't cover the full cost and breweries get annoyed if their casks go missing. If all of this sounds like too much trouble, or you don't have enough time for real ale to settle, you might like to consider buying reracked ('bright') beer from an off-license. This doesn't need time to settle, but will only keep for a day or so. Even so, you still need to consider things like glass cleaning, dealing with spillages, etc. Steve Early From J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:37:14 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:37:14 +0100 (BST) From: Julian Gilbey J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Expo key signing Anyone coming to the Expo: Please bring your PGP and/or GPG keys with you, together with some good photo-ID so that we can do some keysigning while we are there! Thanks, Julian =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Julian Gilbey, Dept of Maths, QMW, Univ. of London. J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Debian GNU/Linux Developer, see http://www.debian.org/~jdg From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:39:23 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:39:23 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Equipment for expo Jules Bean writes: > I have just got my LCIII back from the person who was borrowing it. > > If we want it at the expo, I need to take it to cambridge with me at the > weekend, so I can use the ethernet in my bedroom to install Debian on it > and bring it back down with me next week. > > So, do we want it? It's small and light, and someone suggested that it > might be good to show how debian can leverage legacy > hardware. It's a 25Mhz 68030, so it's pretty damn legacy. Might as well. Ugh - I must try and collate replies to sort out: a) who is coming b) who is bringing what kit -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:33:44 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:33:44 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo 99 update Hi, I've just spoken to the organiser, and he said this: we can set up on the tuesday before from 08:00 to 22:00 there are no objections to selling CDs and T-shirts at costish Beer is rather more tricky; aside from licencing issues if we do anything other than just give it away, the caterers have a monopoly, and may well object - the Itevents guy will contact them and get back to me tommorow. Any progress with furnature, anyone? Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From phil@hands.com 28 Sep 1999 16:35:11 +0100 Date: 28 Sep 1999 16:35:11 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? Philip Hands writes: > Matthew Vernon writes: > > How much would that cost? > > I'll look into it. I may be able to get a barrel at cost price from > one of the bars at Imperial College, in which case we might have a > chance of not running out in the first half hour of the show. I've just had a chat with the manager of the Holland Club, who's willing to sell us a barrel at cost, but says ``I doubt it will be any cheaper than if you went to a supermarket, and it will be too warm, so it will taste disgusting, and you have to sod about the night before to make sure it's ready'' Given that, and the fact that I have a Macro card, we might as well just get a load of tins. At least that way we can have a selection of beers, and some coke or whatever, and we could actually chill them in an ice bucket. Next question: Anyone got transport for lugging large quantities of beer around ? Anyone know where the nearest Macro is, or an alternative source of reasonably priced beer ? Cheers, Phil. From chris@fluff.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:23:57 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:23:57 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On 28 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > Given that, and the fact that I have a Macro card, we might as well > just get a load of tins. At least that way we can have a selection of > beers, and some coke or whatever, and we could actually chill them in > an ice bucket. Yes, more practical (easily restocked mid-show), but no fun! :) A barrel on site would be funky. ;-) We could even try and label it, somehow... -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:52:00 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:52:00 +0100 (BST) From: Jules Bean jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Chris Rutter wrote: > On 28 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > > Given that, and the fact that I have a Macro card, we might as well > > just get a load of tins. At least that way we can have a selection of > > beers, and some coke or whatever, and we could actually chill them in > > an ice bucket. > > Yes, more practical (easily restocked mid-show), but no fun! :) > A barrel on site would be funky. ;-) We could even try and label > it, somehow... If someone knew where to pick a cheap (fake) plastic firkin, we could simply fill that with ice and cans, and sellotape a logo to it. Phil: about transport, I don't know if I will be up first thing Wednesday morning - depends on university schedule. If I am, I can drive around olympia with beer in my car :) On which note: Matthew, could you ask if there's any kind of exhbitor parking htere? There must be, at least for unloading.. and if so, how many spaces are we allowed to use? In terms of beer-money, how do Phil and Steve feel about spending some of their debian-held-in-trust money on it? Are we allowed to do that? Should we ask Wichert/SPI? Jules /----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------\ | Jelibean aka | jules@jellybean.co.uk | 6 Evelyn Rd | | Jules aka | jules@debian.org | Richmond, Surrey | | Julian Bean | jmlb2@hermes.cam.ac.uk | TW9 2TF *UK* | +----------------+-------------------------------+---------------------+ | War doesn't demonstrate who's right... just who's left. | | When privacy is outlawed... only the outlaws have privacy. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 10:55:39 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 10:55:39 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Philip Hands writes: > Jules Bean writes: > > > On 26 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > > Do you know how many Exhibitors passes we need and/or are going to get? > > > > > > Now that they've given us a stand (N. 127 according to the web site) > > > perhaps we should encourage as many Debianites to turn up as possible. > > > A short mail to the main lists would probably be appropriate, > > > mentioning that the free online registration is closing on the 30th. > > > > Doh! > > > > I was assuming that I'd be coming in on an exhibitor pass. I guess I > > can't take that for granted. Should I register, then? > > Well we need to know how many to ask for at least, and it would be > good if everyone registered anyway (I have) so that you can at least > get in to pick up your exhibitors badge, or possibly so that we can > get everyone in regardless of the number of Exhibitors badges they > hand out. I have got 8 coming in the post. If we need more, I can ask. Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From matthew@debian.org Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:24:27 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:24:27 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Philip Hands writes: > Matthew Vernon writes: > > Hi Matthew, > > > Well it looks like we'll be getting a stall after all. So, we have > > about 2 weeks to organise things. > > So, what goes on ? I'd tell you, but I've never been to an Expo. Ask Steve, though I hear laptop install-fests tend be common :) > I've got a couple of feelers out for stand gear (partition walls > etc.), but haven't heard back yet. great. > Do you know how many Exhibitors passes we need and/or are going to get? We need as many as we'll have exhibitors. I don't as yet know how many we'll get. > Now that they've given us a stand (N. 127 according to the web site) > perhaps we should encourage as many Debianites to turn up as possible. > A short mail to the main lists would probably be appropriate, > mentioning that the free online registration is closing on the 30th. I'll send one to -announce, which seems the appropriate list. > I've sent the T-Shirt designs off, and will be getting 100 printed. > The default will be XL reasonably decent white shirts (for 5.52 > IIRC) but there is the option of spending a little more on ``Birch'' > (very light grey flecks) which looks quite good, and/or slightly > heavier T-shirts. The most expensive combo being about 8 quid. > If you have special requests for size, quality or colour, get them in > quick because I'll have to finalise the details with the printers > pretty soon. One XL heavier one in white, please :) > Anyone have opinions about whether to print the back in Black or Red > (or perhaps something else)? I'd have thought black. Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From edward@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 19:12:19 +0100 Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 19:12:19 +0100 From: Edward Betts edward@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --UlVJffcvxoiEqYs2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Matthew Vernon wrote: > Philip Hands writes: > > Well we need to know how many to ask for at least, and it would be > > good if everyone registered anyway (I have) so that you can at least > > get in to pick up your exhibitors badge, or possibly so that we can > > get everyone in regardless of the number of Exhibitors badges they > > hand out. >=20 > I have got 8 coming in the post. If we need more, I can ask. > =20 > Matthew Well, now that I am offically `back on the net' (tm). I can say yes, please= I would like one. I seem to have missed some important discussion whilst I was away. Do I have to fill in some forms on the net? --=20 I consume, therefore I am --UlVJffcvxoiEqYs2 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia iQCVAwUBN/EFAsTul33Z9OdBAQH9ywP+Ph+Wk3oYX29HhD4/USDfG55hz8zaFpCX AW0Jni7HTn/vEDg+yQzUBMZlMuU/s+sptU3xUDyz89Hc3TUXvP8c7czvqT+zxnRn JDnsGopTVCrlKd8B23wR0/vJlDnCDvyQ9nqocKyAgiL9oARYCBKA5kciufOyaK6w l8OlUl0vOm8= =5z2R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --UlVJffcvxoiEqYs2-- From edward@debian.org Wed, 29 Sep 1999 07:49:22 +0100 Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 07:49:22 +0100 From: Edward Betts edward@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Conferance on 30th Sep --uAKRQypu60I7Lcqm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Read http://www.ltt.de/linux_lon.html Interesting? Anybody going? --=20 I consume, therefore I am --uAKRQypu60I7Lcqm Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia iQCVAwUBN/G2ccTul33Z9OdBAQEm6gQAucTrajlDvP9eThNosa9Uq5uzNwuWU9BH 40wXLTue4480t0+uq7h8NR4bcdkl8pO1rpaCZfyXBDODpVSJtgqFHnjr1d/ST/bd O6Y0LJLrZuLjKxZyDL27MnqJXNK5EnuUcXuVAhepKaZ4Rg+9h8m7yGa92fqsJ2ES alG5f7j0TX8= =Y2ki -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --uAKRQypu60I7Lcqm-- From jonathan.heastie@itevents.co.uk Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:22:31 +0100 Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:22:31 +0100 From: Jonathan Heastie jonathan.heastie@itevents.co.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 I have no idea what shell scheme is (a scripting language? :) ) I presume we want "The Debian Project" on it, or just "Debian" (SNB). Matthew --begin forwarded text-- They're just badges with EXHIBITOR on them so that you can get into the building. You can grab a couple of badge holders when you get inside and slip your own business cards in if you want to. Just so you know, your stand includes shell scheme, a name board (what would you like on it?), a powerpoint and a light fitting on the ceiling. It does not include any furniture. You can either bring some of your own or you can hire some from our contractors. Regards Jonathan --end forwarded text-- From phil@hands.com 29 Sep 1999 08:54:03 +0100 Date: 29 Sep 1999 08:54:03 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] [Martin Schulze ] Re: Linux@work --Multipart_Wed_Sep_29_08:54:03_1999-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Hi, I'm forwarding this from debian-private, for those of you that might not have seen it. I doubt that anyone has the time to sort this out by tomorrow, but if you do it would give a chance to do a dry run for next week, if nothing else. Get in touch with Joey if your interested. I might be persuaded to turn up, but I've not got time to do much today, so unless someone else has we're not going to have anything to show anyway. Cheers, Phil. -- |)| Philip Hands [+44 (0)118 9545656] http://www.hands.com/ |-| Philip Hands Computing Ltd. http://www.uk.debian.org/ |(| Unit 1, Cherry Close, Caversham, Reading RG4 8UP ENGLAND --Multipart_Wed_Sep_29_08:54:03_1999-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 08:39:36 +0200 From: Martin Schulze To: Philip Hands Cc: Debian Maintainers Subject: Re: Linux@work Message-ID: <19990929083936.A149@finlandia.infodrom.north.de> Reply-To: Martin Schulze References: <19990927165104.J496@carelia.infodrom.north.de> <874sge3ch8.fsf@sheikh.hands.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Philip Hands wrote: > Martin Schulze writes: > > > Hi, > > > > I'm currently running the booth for Debian at Linux@work in Frankfurt, > > Germany. This conference is touring through Europe this week and the > > next. The organizers were kind enough to offer us a free booth here > > in Frankfurt. It is possible that they would offer the same for the > > events in other cities (London, Zurich etc.). Thus, please take a > > look at http://www.ltt.de/linux.html if you are interested and get > > in touch with the organizers. I can contact them again if you like. > > The events will take place through the next 1.5 weeks so please > > decide fast. > > Is it OK to copy this message to the debian-uk list? Yes. Direct interested people to me, I will then get in touch with the LTT people. We were given two free tickts for the booth staff. You'll also be able to get a 30% reduction if you tell them, that you're from Debian. > I'm not promising anything, because we're in the throws of trying to > organise the booth for the UK Linux Expo '99 next week, so I doubt > many people will be able to get time off for Thursday. > > I might be able to, but I was supposed to be doing my VAT then > (deadline at the end of the month, otherwise the tax man gets angry). > > What does it involve? What are you doing, for example? I went to Frankfurt with a Sun and a Laptop, all other PR material as well (flyers, posters, sample Debian boxes as sold by German distributors). Beneath the desktop we had another PC on which we had LVM installed. Everything was installed before the exhibition so we were there to talk to people, not to hack on the machines. Regards, Joey -- The good thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from. -- Andrew S. Tanenbaum --Multipart_Wed_Sep_29_08:54:03_1999-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --Multipart_Wed_Sep_29_08:54:03_1999-1-- From phil@hands.com 29 Sep 1999 11:06:03 +0100 Date: 29 Sep 1999 11:06:03 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Expo '99: The Great Linux Debate etc. There seem to be a few things in the blurb that say things like: come and listen to all the major vendors.... such as ``The Great Linux Debate''. Are we going to be represented? If so, who's doing it? I don't mind doing it on the Thursday, but I don't suppose I'll be at my sharpest on Wednesday. Cheers, Phil. -- |)| Philip Hands [+44 (0)118 9545656] http://www.hands.com/ |-| Philip Hands Computing Ltd. http://www.uk.debian.org/ |(| Unit 1, Cherry Close, Caversham, Reading RG4 8UP ENGLAND From matthew@debian.org Wed, 29 Sep 1999 15:27:04 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 15:27:04 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian business cards Hi, Anyone got a good graphic for business cards? These might well be useful for replacing whatever we registered as... Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From matthew@debian.org Wed, 29 Sep 1999 09:57:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 09:57:02 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 Edward Betts writes: > Matthew Vernon wrote: > > Philip Hands writes: > > > Well we need to know how many to ask for at least, and it would be > > > good if everyone registered anyway (I have) so that you can at least > > > get in to pick up your exhibitors badge, or possibly so that we can > > > get everyone in regardless of the number of Exhibitors badges they > > > hand out. > > > > I have got 8 coming in the post. If we need more, I can ask. > > > > Matthew > > Well, now that I am offically `back on the net' (tm). I can say yes, please I > would like one. I seem to have missed some important discussion whilst I was > away. Do I have to fill in some forms on the net? http://www.itevents.co.uk/Exhibitions/Linux Registration is free until tommorow, IIRC. Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From matthew@debian.org Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:01:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:01:02 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie FYI - I thought I'd forwarded this, but evidently not. We do have shell scheme, though I don't have any stuff to put on it... Matthew ------- start of forwarded message ------- From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:22:31 +0100 They're just badges with EXHIBITOR on them so that you can get into the building. You can grab a couple of badge holders when you get inside and slip your own business cards in if you want to. Just so you know, your stand includes shell scheme, a name board (what would you like on it?), a powerpoint and a light fitting on the ceiling. It does not include any furniture. You can either bring some of your own or you can hire some from our contractors. Regards Jonathan ------- end of forwarded message ------- -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From phil@hands.com 30 Sep 1999 11:20:32 +0100 Date: 30 Sep 1999 11:20:32 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian business cards Matthew Vernon writes: > Hi, > > Anyone got a good graphic for business cards? These might well be > useful for replacing whatever we registered as... Will this do? http://www.hands.com/~phil/debian/Expo99/ probably a copyright infringement on the use of the Linux Expo logo, but I don't suppose they'll mind --- Do you want to ask them, just to make sure ? Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 30 Sep 1999 12:01:51 +0100 Date: 30 Sep 1999 12:01:51 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie Matthew Vernon writes: > FYI - I thought I'd forwarded this, but evidently not. We do have > shell scheme, though I don't have any stuff to put on it... You already did. Are we hiring furniture, or bringing it, or sitting on the floor ? ;-) I have an Epson Stylus EX A3 printer, so could do someting if I had any inspiration. It might be worth bringing a printer along, so we can use spare moments for printing new things to put up on the wall, and peoples name cards etc. I would bring mine, but I'm going to be on the train, with 100 Tshirts, so a printer is not going to be feasible --- someone else mentioned having and A3 colour printer though. If anyone is planning on driving up from near Reading on the Tuesday, to help set up, I could cadge a lift and bring some more stuff along. We'll need some sticky velcro, and probably some masking tape, if we're planning on sticking A3 sheets together to make banners. Cheers, Phil. From matthew@debian.org Thu, 30 Sep 1999 12:13:46 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 12:13:46 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie Philip Hands writes: > Matthew Vernon writes: > > > FYI - I thought I'd forwarded this, but evidently not. We do have > > shell scheme, though I don't have any stuff to put on it... > > You already did. Doh - Chiark doesn't like me ATM, so is delaying my mail > Are we hiring furniture, or bringing it, or sitting on the floor ? ;-) The only offer was you saying you'd try some companies you knew... if not I'd better get onto the expo's furnature contractors - tables and chairs are all we need, I presume? Matthew -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Thu, 30 Sep 1999 10:42:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 10:42:02 +0100 (BST) From: Julian Gilbey J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian business cards > Hi, > > Anyone got a good graphic for business cards? These might well be > useful for replacing whatever we registered as... > > Matthew Have a look at http://www.debian.org/~kitame/debian_name_card/ and http://master.debian.org/~robt/debiancard.tar.gz for two possibilities. I haven't checked them out -- caveat emptor! Julian =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Julian Gilbey, Dept of Maths, QMW, Univ. of London. J.D.Gilbey@qmw.ac.uk Debian GNU/Linux Developer, see http://www.debian.org/~jdg From chris@fluff.org Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:00:43 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:00:43 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Rutter chris@fluff.org Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian business cards On 30 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > Will this do? > > http://www.hands.com/~phil/debian/Expo99/ I think it's good -- in fact, why not leave the LinuxExpo logo off altogether? That might give some `reuse' potential. I might tweak the fonts a tad to mebbe GillSans or Sabon, but I think it's funky. If you wouldn't mind, it'd be cool if you could print one -- my colour printer's in another part of the country. :) Er, say, Chris Rutter Debian GNU/Linux tcpflow Debian/ARM [or ARM Linux -- what's the best way of indicating this?] www.fluff.org/chris chris@fluff.org Ta, -- Chris ( http://www.fluff.org/chris ) From phil@hands.com 30 Sep 1999 15:15:39 +0100 Date: 30 Sep 1999 15:15:39 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] Debian business cards Chris Rutter writes: > On 30 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > > Will this do? > > > > http://www.hands.com/~phil/debian/Expo99/ > > I think it's good -- in fact, why not leave the LinuxExpo logo > off altogether? That might give some `reuse' potential. I might > tweak the fonts a tad to mebbe GillSans or Sabon, but I think > it's funky. We're not talking rocket science here. To demonstrate, this is the .fig file that specifies the card for me: palm:~$ cat ExpoDebianCard.fig #FIG 3.2 Portrait Center Metric A4 100.00 Single -2 1200 2 2 5 0 1 0 -1 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 5 0 Linux99_S.gif 585 2565 1890 2565 1890 3330 585 3330 585 2565 2 5 0 1 0 -1 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 5 0 offVertColor-phil2.eps 630 630 1845 630 1845 2205 630 2205 630 630 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 90 450 360 450 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 450 360 450 90 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 5175 360 5175 90 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 5265 450 5580 450 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 450 3555 450 3915 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 5175 3555 5175 3825 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 5265 3465 5535 3465 2 1 0 1 0 7 100 0 -1 0.000 0 0 -1 0 0 2 360 3465 90 3465 4 1 0 100 0 18 20 0.0000 4 270 1725 3600 1125 Philip Hands\001 4 1 0 100 0 16 12 0.0000 4 180 1560 3600 2070 ppp, mgetty, rsync\001 4 1 0 100 0 16 12 0.0000 4 180 1575 3600 2295 www.uk.debian.org\001 4 1 0 100 0 16 12 0.0000 4 180 1635 3600 2520 cdimage.debian.org\001 4 1 0 100 0 17 12 0.0000 4 135 1335 3600 2970 www.hands.com\001 4 1 0 100 0 17 12 0.0000 4 180 1365 3600 3195 phil@hands.com\001 4 1 0 100 0 18 18 0.0000 4 210 2415 3600 1575 Debian GNU/Linux\001 palm:~$ That's it Two images, eight lines and a few text placements. Get rid of one image, and stretch the other one and your done for a generic card. Cheers, Phil. > > If you wouldn't mind, it'd be cool if you could print one -- my > colour printer's in another part of the country. :) Er, say, > > Chris Rutter > Debian GNU/Linux > > tcpflow > Debian/ARM [or ARM Linux -- what's the best way of indicating this?] debian-arm ? since that's the mailing list name, makes sense to me, but possibly I'm alone in that. > > www.fluff.org/chris > chris@fluff.org If debian-arm's OK, it's done. Cheers, Phil. From phil@hands.com 30 Sep 1999 18:14:49 +0100 Date: 30 Sep 1999 18:14:49 +0100 From: Philip Hands phil@hands.com Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie Steve McIntyre writes: > 1 i386 box showing demo stuff - list of maintainers, source code listing etc. > 1 i386 box running apps - StarOffice, gimp, WP, quake3 (!), abiword, gnumeric > > and one more non-i386 box to show off our ports. Yes, the old Mac perhaps. I can bring my libretto, although it's generally not set up as a demo machine, so whenever I attempt to show things that I don't generally use myself, it always goes pear-shaped. > Clearly these should be networked, but I'm not sure what else we can show. > And anybody on the stand should be sure to read Martin Schulze's Debian > advantages list at > > http://www.infodrom.north.de/~joey/Debian-Advantages-HOWTO.txt > > so we're able to consistently answer the kinds of questions we'll get. I'll see if I can come up with a decent printout of the xplanet image, with the developer's dots on it. > Phil, any news on getting CDs pressed? I was thinking it would be nice to > have at least some non-i386 CDs available, possibly burnt if the numbers > are small... Doing a run of silvers doesn't pay for itself until you start talking about several hundred pounds worth, which is outside my budget for a givaway. John Walters just offered me 100 of the i386 single disk Debian CDs (bought from cheap bytes) for free (I have to pay him six quid for the cardboard sleeves :). What else are we planning --- I've not got anything but i386 & source images here, so cannot do anything much about non-i386. Any chance of you getting the burners to run of a few sets of non-i386? The thing is we're never going to afford to give away a CD to everyone that turns up, so we have to restrict supply, either to people who show a genuine interest, or by price. I'd imagine that of the 4000+ people that are turning up not many more than a hundred would actually use a CD, if they were given to everyone, so our job is to find those hundred, and persuade them to actually bother to fire it up. If there is more interest than that, we should probably attempt to have some way of pointing people at the web site, such as printing out business cards. The ones that were mentioned today by Julian looked quite good. I'll look at running a some off for myself, but I doubt I'll be able to do many, so anyone else that can do similar would help by thus saving CDs. Cheers, Phil. From P.Allen@pallen.dabsol.co.uk Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:59:33 +0100 Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:59:33 +0100 From: Peter Allen P.Allen@pallen.dabsol.co.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? Jules Bean wrote: > > On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Chris Rutter wrote: > > > On 28 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: > > > > > Given that, and the fact that I have a Macro card, we might as well > > > just get a load of tins. At least that way we can have a selection of > > > beers, and some coke or whatever, and we could actually chill them in > > > an ice bucket. > > > > Yes, more practical (easily restocked mid-show), but no fun! :) > > A barrel on site would be funky. ;-) We could even try and label > > it, somehow... > > If someone knew where to pick a cheap (fake) plastic firkin, we could > simply fill that with ice and cans, and sellotape a logo to it. > > Phil: about transport, I don't know if I will be up first thing Wednesday > morning - depends on university schedule. If I am, I can drive around > olympia with beer in my car :) Hate to think what would happen if you get stopped by the police :-) Peter Allen From matthew@debian.org Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:47:04 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:47:04 +0100 (BST) From: Matthew Vernon matthew@debian.org Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie Hi, I've no idea what a shell scheme is (presumable an oil-based scripting language ;) ). Do we want "The Debian Project", or just "Debian" (SNB)? Matthew ------- start of forwarded message ------- From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:22:31 +0100 They're just badges with EXHIBITOR on them so that you can get into the building. You can grab a couple of badge holders when you get inside and slip your own business cards in if you want to. Just so you know, your stand includes shell scheme, a name board (what would you like on it?), a powerpoint and a light fitting on the ceiling. It does not include any furniture. You can either bring some of your own or you can hire some from our contractors. Regards Jonathan ------- end of forwarded message ------- -- "At least you know where you are with Microsoft." "True. I just wish I'd brought a paddle." http://www.debian.org/ From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:15:41 +0000 (GMT) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:15:41 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Stephen Early wrote: [ a lot of stuff about beer ] >If all of this sounds like too much trouble, or you don't have enough >time for real ale to settle, you might like to consider buying >reracked ('bright') beer from an off-license. This doesn't need time >to settle, but will only keep for a day or so. Even so, you still need >to consider things like glass cleaning, dealing with spillages, etc. Hmmm. It sounds like a lot of hard work, probably too much to be honest. It'd probably be easier to get cans or bottles instead... -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:34:25 +0000 (GMT) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:34:25 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Equipment for expo On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Matthew Vernon wrote: > > So, do we want it? It's small and light, and someone suggested that it > > might be good to show how debian can leverage legacy > > hardware. It's a 25Mhz 68030, so it's pretty damn legacy. > >Might as well. Ugh - I must try and collate replies to sort out: > >a) who is coming >b) who is bringing what kit I'll be going on 3 days: Tuesday after work to help set up (apparently any time Tuesday is OK up to 10pm) All day Wednesday All day Thursday I'll be driving down with the following kit: Hammer (i386, PII, 128MB, 19" monitor) running potato 8-port 10/100 ethernet switch (up to) 8 RJ45 UTP cables power cables (if wanted) Lump (i386, Cyrix 150, 40MB, no monitor, can act as a router for 10base2/10baseT/PPP) If pushed I can possibly help with other cables (network/power) - let me know. I probably have space in the car for one other person with some kit, which is probably going to be Matthew. -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 29 Sep 1999 13:58:08 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 13:58:08 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >Given that, and the fact that I have a Macro card, we might as well >just get a load of tins. At least that way we can have a selection of >beers, and some coke or whatever, and we could actually chill them in >an ice bucket. > >Next question: Anyone got transport for lugging large quantities of >beer around ? Anyone know where the nearest Macro is, or an >alternative source of reasonably priced beer ? How large is large? I'll have a car once we've emptied it of kit, but I don't know where Makro stores are in or near London. -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 29 Sep 1999 14:02:35 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 14:02:35 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Linux Expo '99 --- Free Beer ? On Tue, 28 Sep 1999, Jules Bean wrote: >In terms of beer-money, how do Phil and Steve feel about spending some of >their debian-held-in-trust money on it? Are we allowed to do that? >Should we ask Wichert/SPI? I think that checking would be a good idea, myself. And with (apparently) 4000 people registered, giving away free drinks will get us broke very quickly. Phil suggested only giving drink to people buying t-shirts or similar, but I'm not sure where that would leave us in terms of licensing. -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:50:22 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:50:22 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie On Thu, 30 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >> Phil, any news on getting CDs pressed? I was thinking it would be nice to >> have at least some non-i386 CDs available, possibly burnt if the numbers >> are small... > >Doing a run of silvers doesn't pay for itself until you start talking >about several hundred pounds worth, which is outside my budget for a >givaway. John Walters just offered me 100 of the i386 single disk >Debian CDs (bought from cheap bytes) for free (I have to pay him six >quid for the cardboard sleeves :). OK... >What else are we planning --- I've not got anything but i386 & source >images here, so cannot do anything much about non-i386. Any chance of >you getting the burners to run of a few sets of non-i386? I'll get ~10 sets each of 2.1r2 m68k/sparc/alpha done I guess... >The thing is we're never going to afford to give away a CD to everyone >that turns up, so we have to restrict supply, either to people who >show a genuine interest, or by price. I'd imagine that of the 4000+ >people that are turning up not many more than a hundred would actually >use a CD, if they were given to everyone, so our job is to find those >hundred, and persuade them to actually bother to fire it up. True. >If there is more interest than that, we should probably attempt to have >some way of pointing people at the web site, such as printing out >business cards. The ones that were mentioned today by Julian looked >quite good. I'll look at running a some off for myself, but I doubt I'll >be able to do many, so anyone else that can do similar would help by thus >saving CDs. We could do with fliers for that; I may be able to get some free copies done, but several thousand is probably out of range. What do want on a piece of A4? -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Thu, 30 Sep 1999 11:16:42 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 11:16:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] forwarded message from Jonathan Heastie On Thu, 30 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >Are we hiring furniture, or bringing it, or sitting on the floor ? ;-) Good question. I'm tempted to say hire it to save the hassle of transport, but it would be nice to know costs. >I have an Epson Stylus EX A3 printer, so could do someting if I had >any inspiration. It might be worth bringing a printer along, so we >can use spare moments for printing new things to put up on the wall, >and peoples name cards etc. Might be a good idea. Hmmm. >I would bring mine, but I'm going to be on the train, with 100 >Tshirts, so a printer is not going to be feasible --- someone else >mentioned having and A3 colour printer though. > >If anyone is planning on driving up from near Reading on the Tuesday, >to help set up, I could cadge a lift and bring some more stuff along. > >We'll need some sticky velcro, and probably some masking tape, if >we're planning on sticking A3 sheets together to make banners. True. Anybody any good at this sort of thing? In terms of kit, I've just had an offer from a friend of more help, including potentially his machine - an SMP i386 box with a 21" monitor. Exactly what kit do we think we can/will use on the stand? 2m x 2m isn't very big... I'd suggest at the moment: 1 i386 box showing demo stuff - list of maintainers, source code listing etc. 1 i386 box running apps - StarOffice, gimp, WP, quake3 (!), abiword, gnumeric and one more non-i386 box to show off our ports. Clearly these should be networked, but I'm not sure what else we can show. And anybody on the stand should be sure to read Martin Schulze's Debian advantages list at http://www.infodrom.north.de/~joey/Debian-Advantages-HOWTO.txt so we're able to consistently answer the kinds of questions we'll get. Phil, any news on getting CDs pressed? I was thinking it would be nice to have at least some non-i386 CDs available, possibly burnt if the numbers are small... -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed, 29 Sep 1999 11:28:58 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 11:28:58 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve McIntyre stevem@chiark.greenend.org.uk Subject: [Debian-uk] Expo '99: The Great Linux Debate etc. On Wed, 29 Sep 1999, Philip Hands wrote: >There seem to be a few things in the blurb that say things like: > > come and listen to all the major vendors.... > >such as ``The Great Linux Debate''. > >Are we going to be represented? If so, who's doing it? > >I don't mind doing it on the Thursday, but I don't suppose I'll be at >my sharpest on Wednesday. Hmmm. I dunno, I don't really think of us as vendors. But then again, a "Great Linux Debate" should have some real Free Software people input IMHO. Just don't take that as me volunteering...! -- Steve McIntyre, Allstor Software smcintyr@allstor-sw.co.uk My PC page "Can't keep my eyes from the circling sky, "Tongue-tied & twisted, Just an earth-bound misfit, I..." From matthew at debian.org Wed Sep 1 14:36:11 1999 From: matthew at debian.org (Matthew Vernon) Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:36:11 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Message-ID: ARGH!!! Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw Matthew ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:27:11 +0100=20 From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999=20 Hi Matthew, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and this is my first day back in the office. Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for yo= u at the show if they are making a profit out of you? Regards Jonathan > -----Original Message----- > From:=09Matthew Vernon [SMTP:matthew@debian.org] > Sent:=0925 August 1999 11:49 > To:=09Jonathan Heastie > Subject:=09RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999=20 >=20 > On Mon, 23 Aug 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: >=20 > > I'm sorry but I am not going to be able to give you a free stand at the > > show.. > >=20 > > Despite the fact that I am sympathetic to your cause, the problems > derived > > from giving one exhibitor free space are too many to mention. I have > over > > 45 companies that are investing over =A3100,000 with me and I cannot > possibly > > run the risk of antagonising them by taking money from them but not fro= m > > you. Redhat and SUSE, for example, have spent considerable marketing > funds > > on the show and I am sure that they would not look kindly upon me givin= g > one > > of their rivals a promotional space at the event for absolutely nothing > when > > they had used up months of budget on just one event. > >=20 > > Do you appreciate my problem? Can you suggest an alternative? Is ther= e > > absolutely no money? >=20 >=20 > Dear Jonathan, >=20 > I think you have misunderstood the nature of Debian a little. >=20 > Debian is a voluntary not-for-profit organisation - we > are in no way commercial competition for people like RH and Suse. We make > no profits whatsoever from sale of CDs (although vendors such as Linux > Central can sell them at a profit if they wish - they keep all of that > though): we survive entirely on donations of time, hardware and money. It > is usual for major exhibitions to donate booths to Debian - LinuxExpo > (http://www.linuxexpo.org), Linux World Expo > (http://www.linuxworldexpo.com), and Linuxtag (http://www.linuxtag.org) > all have, for example; surely if donating a booth to Debian was offensive > to companies, then these expos would be unable to do so? Nevertheless, if > you feel RedHat and Suse might be angered by such a donation, then perhap= s > you could contact them, to see if they would object to Debian being > donated a booth? >=20 > Furthermore, your website states: >=20 > We invite you to register for your free VIP visitor pack for > the UK's forum for the new Enterprise computing revolution - > Linux Expo '99. Every major participant in open source > software will be present to provide a definitive review of all > the latest products and services emerging around Linux >=20 > The Debian Project is one of the biggest open source projects in the Worl= d > - our social contract (available from www.debian.org) which states that > Debian will always be 100% free software makes us unique amongst Linux > distributions, and Debian is amongst the top two or three distributions i= n > terms of user base. As such, to exclude us from your Expo would be to los= e > a "major participant in open source software", and being a voluntary > organisation, we cannot produce the sums of money needed to finance booth= s > at Expos; in the past major Expos have donated booths to Debian, and I > hope that you will feel able to continue this trend. >=20 > Yours sincerely, >=20 > Matthew > --=20 > Matthew Vernon > Debian developer > http://www.debian.org >=20 >=20 From damerell at chiark.greenend.org.uk Wed Sep 1 16:54:21 1999 From: damerell at chiark.greenend.org.uk (David Damerell) Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 16:54:21 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <14285.19501.302590.41592@chiark.greenend.org.uk> On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Matthew Vernon wrote: >ARGH!!! >Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw In extremis; get nasty. (Threaten to?) Slashdot them as claiming to have all the major distributors when they do not? -- David/Kirsty Damerell. damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~damerell/ w.sp.lic.#pi.2106 |___| "Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc." Confessed Mercrediphile. |___| | | | Or, in Klingon: "nucharghqangbogh chaH DISopchu' 'e' wItIv." | | | From phil at hands.com Wed Sep 1 17:40:54 1999 From: phil at hands.com (Philip Hands) Date: 01 Sep 1999 17:40:54 +0100 Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) In-Reply-To: (Matthew Vernon's message of "Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:36:11 +0100 (BST)") References: Message-ID: <873dwypotl.fsf@sheikh.hands.com> Matthew Vernon writes: > ARGH!!! > > Any bright ideas? I suspect Linuxcentral would say no, btw What if we get people from current exhibitors to get in touch with them and tell them that they don't object to us getting a freebie, and that in fact they object to us not getting a freebie. Anyone got the contacts to swing that one ? Alternatively, we could adopt guerrilla tactics, and just turn up and set up a Debian stand on a few tables near the bar. This would have the added advantage of guaranteeing that our stand would be near the bar, but might result in them throwing us out. More ambitious, hack into their system, and add ourselves to the list of exhibitors ;-) Cheers, Phil. From phil at hands.com Fri Sep 3 14:46:18 1999 From: phil at hands.com (Philip Hands) Date: 03 Sep 1999 14:46:18 +0100 Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Message-ID: <87aer4qf9x.fsf@sheikh.hands.com> Jules Bean writes: > > What if we get people from current exhibitors to get in touch > > with them and tell them that they don't object to us getting a > > freebie, and that in fact they object to us not getting a freebie. > > > > Anyone got the contacts to swing that one ? > > I don't have any contacts, but that sounds like a sensible strategy. > Perhaps contact a few potentially sympathetic organisation (Linux > Central, maybe even RedHat..) and ask them for opinions.. Perhaps someone like Alan Cox or Steven Tweedie would see our point of view, and might be in a position to get the RedHat marketing folks to do what we want. I've met them both, but I doubt they know who I am. Can anyone do better than that? Cheers, Phil. From matthew at debian.org Wed Sep 8 13:53:21 1999 From: matthew at debian.org (Matthew Vernon) Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 13:53:21 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 In-Reply-To: <687986F525CBD211A15400902727A14D19DE62@MERYL> Message-ID: On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: > Hi Matthew, > > Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and this > is my first day back in the office. > > Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for you > at the show if they are making a profit out of you? Not really - their market is almost entirely US-based. They have contributed a lot to Debian already - to ask them to pay for a booth at a smallish Expo outside of the US would be ridiculous. Besides - I thought you were aiming to have all the major players? Without Debian, that claim will not wash with those that know the Free Software community. I notice you have not responded to my other suggestions either; can I not persuade you that donating a booth to Debian would be in the interests of improving the quality of the Expo? Regards, Matthew From matthew at debian.org Wed Sep 8 16:59:00 1999 From: matthew at debian.org (Matthew Vernon) Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 16:59:00 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Debian-uk] RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 (fwd) Message-ID: Some progress.... ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 15:21:27 +0100 From: Jonathan Heastie To: 'Matthew Vernon' Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 The problem I have is that space is minimal and I have a target to hit. If I give space away, thus losing revenue, I will not hit my target (even small stands make a difference!). I think that I might get to my target in the next week or so and, if I do, I will then have the option to drop prices or (and I've never done this before!) give you a free stand (this is also subject to stand availability too as there are only 5 spaces left and they may have to be sold to get to the target). Do you see my problem? Regards Jonathan > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthew Vernon [SMTP:matthew@debian.org] > Sent: 08 September 1999 13:53 > To: Jonathan Heastie > Subject: RE: Linux Expo'99 - Olympia 6th - 7th October 1999 > > On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Jonathan Heastie wrote: > > > Hi Matthew, > > > > Sorry for the delay in getting back to you - I have off for a week and > this > > is my first day back in the office. > > > > Is there no way that we can get Linux Central to chip in for a stand for > you > > at the show if they are making a profit out of you? > > Not really - their market is almost entirely US-based. They have > contributed a lot to Debian already - to ask them to pay for a booth at a > smallish Expo outside of the US would be ridiculous. > > Besides - I thought you were aiming to have all the major players? Without > Debian, that claim will not wash with those that know the Free Software > community. I notice you have not responded to my other suggestions either; > can I not persuade you that donating a booth to Debian would be in the > interests of improving the quality of the Expo? > > Regards, > > Matthew From russell at coker.com.au Thu Sep 9 12:22:59 1999 From: russell at coker.com.au (Russell Coker) Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 13:22:59 +0200 Subject: [Debian-uk] Re: PGP keys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9909091341121D.09557@lyta> --Boundary-=_oQHnWnkUEwHsqmGbbuqCLJJiVswM Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Sun, 22 Aug 1999, you wrote: >I've tried to find your PGP and/or GPG keys in the Debian keyrings and on >several of the keyservers but I couldn't find them. If you can give me a >place to get them I'll be happy to sign them... I've attached my public key to this email. What is the proceedure for getting my key into the public key servers? The debian-keyring package documents it for pgp but not for gpg. Once you sign my key what do we do next? -- I'm in Utrecht. I'd like to meet any Linux users in the area, or any other part of the Netherlands. --Boundary-=_oQHnWnkUEwHsqmGbbuqCLJJiVswM Content-Type: text/plain; name="public" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="public" LS0tLS1CRUdJTiBQR1AgUFVCTElDIEtFWSBCTE9DSy0tLS0tClZlcnNpb246IEdudVBHIHYxLjAu MCAoR05VL0xpbnV4KQpDb21tZW50OiBGb3IgaW5mbyBzZWUgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5nbnVwZy5vcmcK Cm1RR2lCRFlna1NjUkJBQ3BFVXd6UE5XcEFkNnhlMTdBR2FZMngzOGdmbTF4TDY0YTUxcEhtd0M1 MHcwYmIycmoKSStNN1dTdmlkYnhham9kWlN1a2tEMmNMekVOWVRxZ3pMMll3Snk4d0g2MmVoTGts SlZVYzlhaFZ1WHRUcTdzZgpVeFlmZmxnZUJBMDhmQy9FeElMcURKM2U3Z3NkeGMraStKbFNPNmE4 bGY0R1czTFdrK2x2TjQ2cSt3Q2c0ZVQxCjBHUmFDSlptU3lSMDJOOWdMS2dQd1ZzRC9qTkNUbS9U S2xoUjd5M0pkdGp4OVBNbkhiMU1sNHFhUmJ5Zm1rTnMKSVJVdGx6R1J5R1hIQWkxSllrT1NuTXI2 QlFDSk5sOHljZDkyQkJsZ2U4ZTNnZm9DenZzZGRpTkdrNml6Q0Z4VwpVbnpnbkwwLzFrZ3FlMzRU SFNPdUpYckRIYXBWMnBaUUMwbGZoTk1nQkNmKzh3Y3ArMXMrcElRdlNLWE01SHVzCnJ1MTBCQUNF T0xpS1dwNDltVi8zQjlvZ3NqZklJTWlLR2lmRFRoQmg1NXEySUNoV1BZblJsaXZPb3M5VWd6K3EK ckpyV3VtY0JJQzBiZ29PWDBTWE5JL0ZvNkQ4N08xY0xpd3MxM29YUFR4YldnMU92UjlabEFPc05w SFBXSEExQgp4NC8wMzFsMmdWWDJnYTBvbFdKTzFKbGtHTnBOelVKaTUzODdhODdoNkV1UjE5SExv YlFrVW5WemMyVnNiQ0JECmIydGxjaUE4Y25WemMyVnNiRUJqYjJ0bGNpNWpiMjB1WVhVK2lGY0VF eEVDQUJjRkFqWWdrU2NEQ3dRREJSVUQKQWdZQkF4WUNBUUlYZ0FBS0NSRENzSG44OWNkU1ZrNXZB SjBXT1gzVW5SeHQyWEdrQThqcGtyMTUxdUEzWlFDZgpkTy9EbDg1SzdSQ1J3RkR5Z2tuTW8rNVN2 WUs1QVEwRU5pQ1JOaEFFQUtOTEF